Transcript – Episode 2 – Intentionally Creative

Rena Lewis:

Hello and welcome to The Arena. I’m Rena Lewis, founder and chief strategy officer at Signature Intentions and host of the Arena podcast. In today’s episode, which we’re calling Intentionally Creative, I’ll be speaking with Dan Bucko, senior creative director at Vistage worldwide headquartered in San Diego, California. Vistage is the world’s largest member based coaching and peer advisory organization, helping small and midsize business CEOs and executives, seize opportunities for growth and impact. Dan leads the team of creative professionals in the brand communications group, overseeing the Vistage brand, including their internet and intranet properties, digital print, and social media assets and their video and photo studio. He is also an award-winning multimedia designer, accomplished photographer and brand warrior. And I think you’re in for a real treat today because Dan is among the very best creative minds, I’ve had the pleasure of working with throughout my career. His ability to turn ideas, words, and strategic intent into art to drive meaningful connections with an audience is just truly a beautiful thing. So, let’s get to it. Hello, Dan. Welcome. And thanks for taking the time to be with me here in The Arena.

Dan Bucko:

Hi Rena. Thanks for having me.

Rena Lewis:

My pleasure. Thank you. Let’s start with the journey that led to your current role at Vistage and why you chose graphic design as your unique profession.

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. I actually started in music, back in the day before the web was around and before there were a lot of professional and collegiate classes on how to be a graphic designer. I played music and would travel from Los Angeles up to San Francisco all in the hopes of getting a record deal. And eventually got one with Warner Brothers and it was a great lesson in being creative, but I think it was a bigger lesson in running your own business and being your own marketing group and advertising agency. It’s one thing to learn how to play an instrument and play music in front of people, but it’s another to market yourself, and go out there and get gigs and get that record deal. Get people who were willing to pay you for your music. So it was a great education in the creative field that way. And I moved from the visual medium into the, or the audio medium into the visual medium, as I transitioned from music into my first agency in Santa Barbara. I kinda grew up with the web essentially. So as the internet was developing, I was developing my own skills as a designer. I worked for a company in Santa Barbara who was really more of a technical company. They provided internet access before most people knew what internet access was to people in companies. And they would give away a free webpage with each contract. And my role essentially was to work with that client and create their webpage for them. So I’m just very rudimentary Paisley out on a very primal mosaic browser back in the day.

Dan Bucko:

So as I was working with those folks, I taught myself HTML and ultimately CSS how to do videos and going from shockwave to all these different technologies that have come and gone. And went from a designer at this agency to some other agencies, moved down to San Diego, worked my way up to an art director and senior art director helping not only create, but also direct other creatives and ultimately into my own business. And as senior creative director for a few companies now. So the music thing really ignited this passion for creative. And I found myself here doing some really fun visual and audio projects in my current role.

Rena Lewis:

Well, it certainly sounds like you’ve had some exciting and interesting experiences who I’m wondering has been who is most inspired you during your career, in what way? And what’s been the best advice that you received along the way?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I’ve, I’ve come across a lot of folks in the creative industry from the music days, a lot of really creative bosses and people have worked with clients. One gentlemen stands out in my mind when you ask that question. A guy was on my team when I worked at an agency down here, his name was Grant Raniero, he really inspired me. I just observed how he would take tricky situations with clients or with coworkers and just, succeed. How he would get through stressful situations or maybe an impasse and he would just apply some humor and deflate the situation and ultimately do something really incredible and seemingly very easily. And we had some discussions about it and he’s just like, well, every time you to get to this point, if you just tell a joke or find some kind of funny connection, even if it’s at your own self detriment it tends to deflate the situation and kind of get you to the next place where everyone’s feeling good about what everybody’s doing.

Rena Lewis:

I love that. Humor is that a universal equalizer in that sense. So that sounds great. So let’s take a moment and talk about Vistage for a second. How would you define Vistage’s brand purpose? And I’m wondering specifically, how are you all as a company leaning into that purpose, particularly during this era of, COVID-19 and quite frankly, everything else that’s happening in our country right now?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. It’s the first time I’m working for a major business company. A lot of times I’ve worked for art companies or agencies or retail. And our purpose at Vistage is to we exist solely to help high integrity leaders CEOs and business owners make the great decisions that benefit their companies and families, and ultimately their communities and people that they pull employees from. How do they elevate all these different people and places? And we, our team is focused on creating inspiration and information events, marketing packages and things like that for these business owners, so that they can be more successful. And as we lean into that purpose we’re trying to support small dash medium businesses, and help them create big dash giant impacts in the world that we live in.

Dan Bucko:

And so we are focused on that. And right now with this current situation that we’re in we’re having to transition ourselves, we’re, our audience tends to be a little older and a little, maybe less technical savvy. So we relied heavily on in-person and in print before COVID. With this crisis, we’ve had to adapt and move everything into more of a digital format taking a lot of our print marketing and going digital, doing things like taking our magazine that will come out twice a year. We’re actually designing a digital first version of that for the first time currently, which will be out in January. So transitioning these events from in-person to virtual, giving our events team ways to promote events, day of event environments, where they can celebrate speakers and inspiration and information, and then post event, how you wrap up things and, give that back to the people who attended. So really going digital and trying to adapt and move forward in this new normal.

Rena Lewis:

Yeah, certainly. And how about under the diversity equity and inclusion umbrella is Vistage taking any intentional steps toward moving the needle in that area?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. Good question. So Vistage is a really a made up word. It is a Vista and advantage. It’s an advantage of a new Vista or a new view, a new perspective. And for 60 years we’ve been around it’s really about bringing 12 to 16 business owners into a group who all are completely different. So A) There’s no competition, but B) You get to benefit from these diverse perspectives. Maybe you need something a little more feminine, or maybe you need something a little more youthful. To be able to position all of these different executives in a room gives them this advantage of a new perspective and a diverse perspective. So our company is, has embraced that. And we definitely are trying to embrace the current times and be more mindful of and purposeful of creating a diverse group where we are right now and where we want to be are two different things.

Dan Bucko:

So we’re genuinely trying to listen and we’ve put together a task force and we put together a statement but, long term how can this be a long play and not just a short term thing that you focus on because it’s trending right now. And we brought together folks who created a network and we’re really working at looking at ideas of how to reach a more diverse audience and inspire them to join these groups at the member level, at our chair level, how can you direct a group and get them to go out and help you bring in people who maybe wouldn’t have joined your group in the past. And, long-term trying to apply that to our core purpose.

Rena Lewis:

Yeah, that makes sense to me. I can certainly understand how Vistage can certainly be leaning into making sure that you are hearing from you’re hearing diverse perspectives and experiences, from different member organizations, who are your customers. And also, I love the fact that you understand, or you’re owning up to the reality of perhaps you’re not where you want to be, but you really understand from the data and the and the facts in terms of where you are and being really intentional around how do we move this? How do we get closer to our to where we want to be? So I really, I applaud you and the team and the company in that area. How specifically have you, how about you and your team? How have you guys adapted, any unique experiences to keep your team feeling connected and inspired and or resilient during this time?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. We, we’ve all been working from home for the last six months. I think we’re set up professionally from being able to receive projects and manage projects and get them out distribute them fairly well. I mean, we’ve been online, I think before most other departments in my company, but one thing is you start to lose connection with people if you’re not physically sitting next to them. So recently when I was asked to lead a marketing meeting and rather than just go around the table and say, what’s everyone working on, I like, Hey, let’s put our pencils down and put our creative caps on. And everyone send me an image and I want that image to be an object that represents you. Maybe something that we don’t know.

Dan Bucko:

And I want you to explain why you chose that object and, know why you feel it represents you. I was recently watching the John Lewis celebration of life and just these incredible speeches about him and people who knew him, his family and friends and former presidents, and just found myself to be very introspective and, and emotional about how great a person was and what are they going to say about me when I’m not around? So how could I get everyone to feel that way and, and talk about that and say, what is it that represents you? And even more than that, when you’re gone, what is it that you want to stand, still be standing there that represented you while you were around. So I got things from like a picture of a tent.

Dan Bucko:

My buddy Patrick sent me a picture of this tent that he’s had since he was 13 and was a boy scout. He said, he’s had some amazing conversations with his dad in this tent. And it represents this history of getting out in nature. And, it’s very personal to him. Somebody else sent a pendant of their grandmother had given them with their grandmother’s initials on it and how that person was very inspirational to them. And she feels like that that keeps her grandmother close to her even though she’s passed away. So a lot of really cool things came in that I didn’t even know about my team or people that worked in the marketing department that I think really did connect us in a, in a way that we hadn’t been connected before, even though we’ve all been working together for some pieces six years.

Dan Bucko:

And what, when we get back into the office, I think what I really want to do is I want to take everybody’s photo and do some sort of a cool visual collage that we could , put up in an area that we can all see, just to remind us of that thing, about that person, so that when they’re away for the week on PTO or at a meeting or whatever, and we walk by that from getting coffee, it’s like, Oh, there’s that tent. Or there’s that pendant. That’s Patrick and that’s Bridget. So that’d be kind of a fun way that cement that in people’s minds.

Rena Lewis:

Dan, what a great experience, what a great idea, great idea to do with your team. I commend you for that. What, what I’m wondering I want to know what object did you choose for yourself and what did that object mean to you?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, yeah. You’d think it would be like a paint brush or a guitar hammer or something oddly enough, what I brought in was, or what I took a found a photo of is that a blank of paper.  I thought that that was a really interesting way to kind of define who I am. I love the beginning of a project when, when nothing has happened yet so much opportunity is what it represents. Whether it’s taking a picture or writing some music or creating a page layout, this physical aspect of a blank sheet just gives me goosebumps. And so that’s what I chosen I think it’s a great metaphor for life. You start off as a blank page and as you go through life, you add experiences that page and accomplishments successes and failures and relationships. So that by the time you get to the end, you’ve got this full page of all this stuff that represents you. So that’s why I chose that.

Rena Lewis:

I love that, Dan, I think that’s wonderful. In that same spirit of sort of key lessons, earned and learned, share an experience, if you don’t mind, with us when something didn’t go as originally planned or maybe something failed. And how did you regroup about that? Or what lessons did you learn from that? Or just, can you do have a use case or something that you’d like to share with our listeners in terms of, wow, we tried this. Didn’t go very well, but here’s what we learned from it. And here’s how we regroup from it all. Would you mind sharing an experience like that please?

Dan Bucko:

Yes. The old, how did you have a bad experience and turn it into a good one question for sure.

Rena Lewis:

Yes!

Dan Bucko:

 We have a philosophy at our company. You can’t, you do your most growth when you get out of your comfort zone. Right? So I work for a company, Modern Postcard, way back in the day and was asked to kind of create a small agency within the company. We were selling postcards and we could track when the postcard hit the mail stream and was delivered. And then that was the end of that relationship. And we wanted to continue that story, right. So how could you put an offer on a postcard and maybe get somebody to take an action on that offer and be able to report back to the company that you’re giving the offer on their behalf, and maybe the offer triggers some sort of a card or something that you would then take into a retail place and purchase something, and then I can report back on what they purchased and then that would trigger the next message.

Dan Bucko:

And there’s really good idea of this kind of what we were calling spiral marketing concept. And it was all excitement, and we were ready to go. And then we ended up kind of focusing more on a specific industry, LASIK, the LASIK industry. And we kind of limited a lot of our options and went with an industry that didn’t have a ton of business opportunities. And while we put together an incredible program and had all the best intentions, it never really got off the ground. So ultimately that, that failed, but in the process of going that direction I was exposed to some incredible people and some incredible ideas and this concept of a multi-touch campaign, which is pretty obvious now, but it wasn’t so back in the day, where you just moved the needle a little bit at the time using different channels and you gradually get somebody to raise their hand, give some information and connect with you, and then make that purchase or acquire that service or whatever it is you’re ultimately trying to do.

Dan Bucko:

And so while the venture was a failure of the knowledge that I gained I apply all the time now with multimedia and multitouch nurture campaigns and funneling and all those things that we do. It’s just so obvious now, but it wasn’t so back in the day.

Rena Lewis:

Yep. We’ve all had those. So makes perfectly good sense. Thank you for sharing that. I’m wondering, do you have a particular ritual or a process to open the creative ways before designing what gives you clarity and how do you help guide yourself and your team when it’s time to design something new that you’re charged with doing?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I think I find inspiration in a lot of places I feel like I’m doing a lot of juggling. So I’m handing a lot of projects at once and we one maybe starts to hit a little bit of a wall or feeling like it’s in a box, I move on to something else maybe I go out and  go on a photo adventure or go watch a movie, or maybe I’ll just go to the beach and suddenly there’s this really cool sign, and it’s got this incredible typography on it that lights a light bulb on that project that you’re stuck in, or I’ll hear some music that has some rhythm that, Oh, wow. I didn’t think about that when I was writing that headline or shooting that video, how great would it be to be able to incorporate that inspiration that I just found in a seemingly non-inspirational place and apply it to something totally different to kind of get me around that obstacle or that brick wall, or get me out of that box that I’m in.

Rena Lewis:

And what does that process look like when you’re working with an internal client, as I alluded to in my opening remarks about you the ability to really transform words and strategy into the art farm, what does that process look like for you and your team at Vistage? You deal with creative reeves. What do you do to, what do you need to understand the user what’s the strategic intent? What’s your process, or what’s the ideal process that you all go through there, this stage to get that translation effectively?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I mean, I think when you are doing things on your own you don’t have to talk to anybody it’s all in your head and each additional person that you add to the process creates a game of telephone, right? Things get translated ideas or strategies. People have different ideas on how to execute. Communication obviously is key. But doing it in the right way, let’s sit down, let’s put our pencils down. Let’s not think about a tool or an application. Let’s think about what is it that we really want to do? Why are we building this website? What, ultimately, we want to get out of this website, or why are we putting this ad together? What’s this ad supposed to do, or this brochure or this event. And you very quickly like I was talking about before, realize that it’s just about moving traffic or your audience to the next thing, it’s not about doing everything getting them to feel something or giving them an experience. Whether it’s just building a brand and getting that name or that logo, or that purpose to kind of stick in your head or at the cash register, getting somebody to make a purchase.

Dan Bucko:

I think balance is key. I think that you want to talk about strategy and figure out where you want to go from A to Z in 26 steps. But not rush right into Z because you’ve got 25 steps before. How do you leverage everybody’s expertise and get them to stay in their lane? I got a copywriter who writes some incredible copy, but also wants to give me visual direction. Thank you for those ideas, but let’s let the visual folks come in, and, they’re not writing the copy. So how do you get everybody’s ideas out at the beginning and then make some decisions? I think that it’s not a democracy. Certainly good ideas come everywhere, but I think once you start going, you need to build a structure and realize that okay, this is an intentional decision. And I may alienate a few folks over here or this type of this audience, but the main focus is still this piece and that’s okay. Let’s not get watered down and I’m going to do their jobs and just kind of shepherd it along the way and not micromanage inspire people, joke around and it all comes together.

Rena Lewis:

Hmm. And would you say you have that process, a process in place to make sure because you’re making a really good point, Dan. Sometimes you could, the original can get so watered down where it loses the intention for the audience that you’re trying to build a connection with and the sort of relevance that you’re trying to convey with that graphic design or visual art form. So making sure that upfront, we’re just, we’re defining, as you said, those things that are in terms of who the audience is, what is this piece supposed do? What is the intent for this piece and what is the experience that we want to the user to have when they are engaging? Is that right? Did I capture that? Is that, that’s what I heard you, it sounds like you’re saying, is that right?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. I, we have a million acronyms at our company and we’re always trying to like, to create another acronym or whatever, but , I subscribed to K.I.S.S., which I think everybody has heard of it before. Right. Keep It Simple, Stupid. Less is more, how can you take all these ideas work with all these people take all these subjective opinions and weed get rid of everything that’s not essential. And just keep it simple. It will be way more elegant. It be way more inspirational and just way more powerful if you could get rid of everything that is not essential.

Rena Lewis:

And what does that word, you hear that word a lot, simplicity. People were trying to go from, trying to take the complex and turn that into very simple and into something very simple. What does that word, simplicity, mean to you, Dan?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I mean, I think keeping things simple, it obviously , keeps them very elegant. Just the essential items. I’ve used the analogy of music before if everyone’s playing their instrument the same time it’s just a lot of noise, right. But if you can weed out the stuff that’s not essential and tell these folks to be light and these folks to be strong and then switch it you create this harmony. And ultimately it creates power this contrast that’s intentional. It’s intelligent and it’s elegant and powerful.

Rena Lewis:

And would you also say clarity? It’s clarifying.

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, definitely. It’s it reduces everything that’s not there and just focuses on the essence.

Rena Lewis:

Yeah. I think that’s really important. If I could wave the proverbial magic wand, Dan, what would your ideal creative project be and how would it all flow perfectly together?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I think being a corporate artist is, is awesome and it certainly pays the bills more than music did. But I’m definitely attracted to being a fine artist. Right. My ideal creative project would be something that I would do for myself ultimately. How could I create something that inspires me or moves me, creates an experience for myself and then creates that same experience or moves the other people the same way that would be my ultimate creative project. It started with music. I love taking pictures. It’s just for me, but if other people can find the same inspiration in those and then fantastic.

Rena Lewis:

It sounds like you have a true creative spirit, my friend. , earlier you kindly shared the vested advice that you received, and I’m wondering what advice you would give to up-and-coming design professionals.

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I think I would tell people that we’re trying to get into the field, or trying to get into one of the companies that I’ve worked with that a key component to have is balanced, right? You can find your niche, you can go really deep in something, but if you don’t have the balance to see how that thing translates across a channel into a different discipline from your company to another company, from your agency back to the company that you’re working for. I think that you’re lacking some perspective and I would definitely request that you seek some balance, inform yourself and get some experience if you’ve just worked and they didn’t see before work client side and kind of see how going deep is different than skimming across multiple brands. If you’ve worked for a media company see what retail is all about or manufacturing, or give yourself all these experiences, because it’ll just make you that much more invaluable as you work in your niche but sell it or translate it across these other channels and mediums and different audiences.

Rena Lewis:

Hmm. Sounds like , you’re saying taking a more generalist approach and understanding the connectivity amongst all the moving parts or seeing the bigger picture. Sometimes it’s hard to see the bigger picture when you’re in the frame. So the ability to be able to take a step back and see the broad scope and then hone in on the particular aspects of it would be a good thing that you would advise you would advise folks to do. So, is that right?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. Yeah. I think having that vision, right. Obviously, you need to be in the weeds and know what you’re doing with your discipline, but if you only have that view, it’s easy to stray off path. So it’ll be able to kind of pop your head up a little bit and see how, what you’re doing translates to the bigger picture or across different breaks, so to speak. I think you’ll be a way more successful in what you’re doing.

Rena Lewis:

Yeah. Would you also include being curious in that skill set as well? Also always having like a curious mind, a curious eye about the things around you and how they, how they fit and how they align or you, how do you feel about that?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah, I mean, I think you always adapt, right. With the COVID, we’re adapting, as you go to the beach and you see that sign, you’re inspired you’re always taking things in. I’m a visual person, I’m an emotional person. So when an emotional thing happens, that affects me. So curious and receptive to some of these things creatively or professionally. Absolutely.

Rena Lewis:

Terrific. So finally, let me ask you what would be some of your favorite go-to resources and what are those things that you use to help keep you informed and well equipped and battle ready today?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. I kind of grew up with the internet. So I had to find things out on my own, work through a whole page of code for five hours to find that one quotation mark is messing up the whole page and there are, there’s no one out there is going to tell you that. So I always start with Google, how can I go to a place where I can start accessing what other people are doing or what other people have done. Most folks are very willing to share on the web. Obviously, you can’t trust everything on the web, but you can at least get some information and decide what you’re going to do with that. So that’s typical mine. Typically, my go-to is Google. I’ve got a bunch of Pinterest boards.

Dan Bucko:

I think it’s great to work with clients and teammates. When you’re doing mood boards, Pinterest is a fantastic resource for that to go out and find and pin whether other people have done. He had like this color; I like that shape. I like this type. That’s another place I hang out. I do have some mold design books, photo books clip art from way back in the day page layout books that, are still relevant today. So I’ll pull those off the shelf, dictionary.com, thesaurus.com. There’s some great dictionaries out there that, Hey, I need words that start with this letter, or that place is a great resource. I like checking out word websites. The Webbies, they’ve been around for as long as the web’s been around and there’s some incredible designs whether it’s just more inspirational and experiential to just, Hey, I need a corporate looking thing and what have other people done in that space?

Dan Bucko:

The FWA is another place that has a lot of great websites and advertising type of awards when it comes to humor. I subscribe to The Onion. The Onion’s great at making you laugh and kind of, taking the stress out of things and looking at things differently. And if you’re a self-starter, there’s no better place to go, then lynda.com to learn a new piece of software or teach yourself a new, thing when it comes to whatever you are interested in. It’s a great resource.

Rena Lewis:

Hm. Terrific. Thank you. Thank you for that. I’m going to have to check a couple of those out. I’ve never heard of, like, I’ve never heard of theonion.com. I’m going to have to check that out. Cause I’m always in for a bit of a of humor. I’ve enjoyed our chat so much, Dan, and appreciate you for just generously sharing your experiences and your insights. So thank you so much. Thank you so much for this. And I also would love to, well, where can our listeners find you to learn more?

Dan Bucko:

Yeah. Yeah. Thanks for having me. I appreciate being the first one out of the gate.

Rena Lewis:

Yes, my Guinee pig.

Dan Bucko:

Exactly. If you want to find me, I’m doing a lot of posting and Instagram these days. My photography is @danbuckophotography on Instagram, danbucko.com will show you some recent things that I’m doing professionally and I’m always available on LinkedIn. So those are three spots where you can find me.

Rena Lewis:

Terrific. Well listeners, I encourage you to absolutely go to Dan’s resources and sites to learn more. And I appreciate you all listening and spending this time with us here today in The Arena, and we’ll see you next time. Thank you.

Dan Bucko:

Thanks Rena.

Rena Lewis:

Thank you. Bye now.